Podcast Ep. 122: Making a Lasting Impression: Etiquette Tips for Holiday Parties, Job Interviews and Networking From Purdue’s Westwood Event Coordinator Anthony Cawdron

Anthony Cawdron: 

This is Anthony Cawdron and you are listening to This is Purdue. 

Kate Young: 

Hi, I’m Kate Young and you are listening to This is Purdue, the official podcast for Purdue University. As a Purdue alum and Indiana native, I know firsthand about the family of students and professors who are in it together, persistently pursuing and relentlessly rethinking who are the next game-changers, difference-makers, ceiling-breakers, innovators, who are these Boilermakers? Join me as we feature students, faculty and alumni taking small steps toward their giant leaps and inspiring others to do the same. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Your resume says a lot about you, but it’s only two-dimensional. I mean, the way people present themselves. If you look like you are looking after your own clothes and your shoes are shined, it’s likely to tell me that you’re going to look after someone else’s assets just as well. I do start out by saying a lot of this is common sense. The problem is that sense isn’t that common anymore. And it’s not rocket science, but it does help rocket scientists get better jobs. 

Kate Young: 

In this episode of This is Purdue, we are talking to Anthony Cawdron, Westwood Event Coordinator and Estate Manager. Westwood is the official home to Purdue’s presidents since the 1970s and currently President Mung Chiang and his family reside in this historic home. Now, if you’ve ever had the chance to go to Westwood for an event or dinner as either a student, alumni or staff or faculty member, you likely know Anthony, but just in case, here’s a quick bit of background on him before we dive into our conversation. Anthony has been at Purdue for 24 years now, but he’s originally from the UK. He’s lived all over the world and has even worked in a few European castles. And he also teaches a business etiquette course here at Purdue. So from job interviews to networking events to holiday parties, Anthony is sharing his best etiquette tips with us in this episode. 

Well, what’s a great way to spur small talk? What should you order for an interview over lunch? And what’s a polite way to leave a party? Hint, it is not the Irish exit, okay. Plus this conversation is the latest episode in our Boilermaker Bites series where we get to know Purdue Boilermakers while sharing a meal. And today, we’re chatting over some tea and other English goodies, which is especially fitting for Anthony’s background. And there’s really no better place for Anthony to tell us about his Boilermaker journey than within the walls of Westwood. To set the stage for you all briefly, Anthony and I had our interview in the smaller, more intimate dining room. It has a very classic traditional look with dark wood furniture. Anthony set the table with a gold pattern tablecloth and some black and gold China, including a teapot and matching teacups. The full video interview is also on our This is Purdue YouTube page if you’d like to check out this beautiful setup on there. 

Okay. So without further delay, let’s get into my conversation with Anthony. Oh, and a quick warning, this episode is likely to make you a bit hungry. Anthony, thank you so much for joining us today on This is Purdue. We’re thrilled to talk to you. This is the latest episode of our Boilermaker Bites series. So we have some lovely snacks and tea that are set up. Tell us a little bit about this before we dig into Westwood and your journey. Okay. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes. So we have the classic English cucumber sandwiches. So the cucumbers on thin sliced bread with no crusts. Then we have some profiteroles with some gold dust of course, and then some macarons with poppy seeds and key lime, and then we have some homemade scones. 

Kate Young: 

And you made them, right? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

I made them, yes I made them this morning. There’s a big debate on how you pronounce it. Some people say scones, some people say scones. I’m a scone side. And then when we eat them, there’s a big debate as to which you put on first, is the jam or the cream? And I’m jam first, then cream. So that’s just the way I do it, but a lot of people are wrong. 

Kate Young: 

Well, thank you so much for having us here. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

You’re welcome. Thank you for coming. 

Kate Young: 

And for making this lovely arrangement. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes, absolutely. 

Kate Young: 

We’re at Westwood, this is the home to Purdue’s presidents. You’ve been here as the estate manager and event coordinator for over 20 years. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes, 24 last week, or last month. 

Kate Young: 

Oh my goodness, congratulations. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Thank you. 

Kate Young: 

So you’re actually from the UK though. I’m sure our listeners can tell. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Sometimes. Everyone in England thinks I have an American accent. 

Kate Young: 

Okay, well we’re excited to get into your journey. Like I said, this property is so beautiful. I’m sure no day is the same for you. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

No, which is actually one of the good things at 24 years is, if the days were all the same, you wouldn’t be able to do it. So I think that having variety and different events and different things going on and different people coming in and out and projects that don’t involve guests as well, all of that type of thing, keeping the outside looking good and redoing the driveways and all those type of things. 

Kate Young: 

Yes. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes. 

Kate Young: 

Absolutely. Tell us about your journey to West Lafayette since we do know you’re from the UK. How does your experiences overseas kind of set you up for success here? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yeah, so my father was in the Air Force, so I was a military brat, if you’d like it that way. So we moved a lot when I was growing up and we lived in Hong Kong, Singapore, then returned to England where I finished my high school and then did catering college for two years, and then went to work in Switzerland for a year and then came back and finished my degree at Oxford Brookes University. Then got into, almost by accident, working at Blenheim Palace that then turned into Sutton Place, being the butler there at 21, which was a little bit daunting. My first guest was Prince Philip, and so it was a little overwhelming at times, but did that and then went back into the restaurant industry. 

Then had a call from somebody who said, “Would you like to teach?” And so I moved to Switzerland again and taught in a hotel school there. And then had an opportunity to do a work abroad project with Iowa State ostensibly for a year. And so I left Switzerland intending to come back, and I haven’t gone back yet. So that was 34 years ago. So I think that overall travel and just being involved in international hotels and restaurants and seeing things from that perspective is really what started me interested in the events, business and catering type of thing. 

Kate Young: 

Anthony explains how his experiences working within the Blenheim Palace and Sutton Place in England ignited his passion for event planning and etiquette. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

I think it gave me the opportunity to see exactly how things should be done, and just the attention to detail and how to look after people and working with people from higher ranks, if you like, and royalty and all those type of things. So I think it set me up quite well as being able to handle guests of every caliber and every background. 

Kate Young: 

As Anthony previously mentioned, he left Switzerland for a work abroad project in the US at Iowa States in Ames, Iowa. It was there that he met former Purdue president Martin Jischke, and his wife Patty. Anthony discusses how being at Iowa State and meeting this couple changed the trajectory of his career. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

So I was there, as I said, for a year. And then during that year, I think for the first time people really tried to nurture me in continuing my education. And so it was suggested I take my master’s degree there at Iowa State, which I did. And then the Jischke’s arrived during that period and certainly were well aware that they needed somebody to be more involved with the event side of things because the previous president had not done as much entertaining as they wanted. And so they asked me to do a couple of things just to help out to start with, and then it developed into part-time, full-time, and then eight years working with them at Iowa State. And yes, it was a wonderful opportunity. 

Kate Young: 

So how did they ask you to come to Purdue? How did you finally end up here? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

There was a big debate in Iowa, in Ames, as to whether I would or whether I wouldn’t go. And it was actually the Des Moines Register put more interest in my leaving than them. So it was was, will he go, won’t he go, will he go, won’t he go? And so I flew here with Patty and Martin on a couple of occasions to look around and see. And so it was a pleasant surprise and so I said, “Okay, I’ll come for six months and see how it is.” So I lived in the apartment above the garage for six months and got used to being here and decided I liked it and said I’d stay. And that was, as I said, 24 years ago. 

Kate Young: 

24 years ago. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes. 

Kate Young: 

So tell us about your role at Westwood. I know every day is different, but what are some of your duties and responsibilities here? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

So basically keeping the house looking as good as it can. I have a team of wonderful housekeepers, Sheila and Tammy. And they do a fantastic job of making sure that the house is always ready because you never know when the president’s office may call and say if somebody’s coming over, and you can’t be just suddenly rushing around. So keeping the house ready, and then obviously with the events, working with the president’s office in making sure that we’re up-to-date on what’s happening, who’s coming, making name tags, making place cards. And then obviously working with the chef probably once a week to see what events we have coming up. There are weeks when we have fewer events, and then there are weeks where we have lots of different things. 

Kate Young: 

Every night. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes. And no, also during the day. I’d say that Mitch used to entertain more at breakfast time because there was no family and people getting to school and things like that. So we did more entertaining in the mornings with him. But as I said, the variety is what keeps it interesting. And obviously the seasons and the things inside outside the house as well. 

Kate Young: 

What is one of your earliest memories of Westwood? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

I think the first time when, as I said, Patty and I traveled with Martin to come to see what West Lafayette was like, and I remember driving through the gates. Iowa State’s president’s house is like many Big 10 schools in campus, and we had parking for about five cars in the driveway. And I drove in here and you’ve got almost a mile of drive. And so just the setting was very, very different from what we were used to and just a sort of a sense of a big house. And then seeing the spaces that we had to work with was wonderful because again, the Iowa State house was Victorian, and so it wasn’t necessarily designed or easy to use as Westwood is. Westwood is very versatile as we’ve hosted events for eight people or 250 people. So it’s a lot of things like that. Can I pour you some tea? 

Kate Young: 

Yes. Oh my gosh, please do. And we have to try one of the homemade scones. Did I say it right? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

You did. And so this teapot is actually from China that was given to the house back in the 1990s, and we have some pieces, unfortunately it’s aging and so it does need some care and it’s not always leaking, but this one is not. So good, so far. 

Kate Young: 

It’s beautiful. Now, do you enjoy milk with your tea? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

I do take milk in my tea. 

Kate Young: 

Okay. I do too. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

And we’re doing it the right way, because if you put milk in first, then that’s very- 

Kate Young: 

Good to know. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

And that’s where the phrase MIF comes from. M-I-F, milk in first. And people who put milk in first are second class. 

Kate Young: 

We’re learning all types of things on this podcast. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

All right, I’ll give you a sandwich. 

Kate Young: 

Thank you so much. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

You’re very welcome. 

Kate Young: 

Okay, so fast-forward, President Jischke leaves in 2007. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes. 

Kate Young: 

What made you want to stay here at Purdue? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

And we knew that Dr. Jischke was going to retire in 2007, so that was all expected. And then when Dr. Cordova and Chris Foster came here on a sort of a sightseeing trip visit, I was obviously here and was cooking breakfast for them, and then they sort of said, “Will you stay?” And I said, again, “Yes, we’ll give it a try.” And so it’s sort of become a hand-me-down thing. I think you get the house, you get him too. 

Kate Young: 

I think they’re thrilled to have you though with the house. So what has it been like for you to experience the Midwest? Back when you lived in the UK, could you ever picture yourself where you are now? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

No, I really didn’t. And when I was in Switzerland, some of my students there said, “You’ll absolutely hate it. You won’t fit in. It would be awful and you won’t like it and you’ll be back in… You won’t even stay a year.” So I was somewhat not worried, but trepidation I’d say, because I called a bank in London and said, “Can I set up an account in America?” And they went, “Ooh, not sure. Where are you going to live?” And I said, “Iowa.” They said, “Ooh.” They said, “We think there’s a bank in Des Moines.” And I thought, well, I have to drive 20 miles to a bank. That’s not the worst thing in the world. And then you arrive in Ames and there are multi-story hotels, a huge stadium and massive, massive buildings. You think, we’ll be okay. 

Kate Young: 

Absolutely. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes. 

Kate Young: 

What are a few of your most significant memories from your 24 years here? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Gosh, I think entertaining some… We’ve had three Secretaries of State come to dinner, Madeleine Albright, Colin Powell and Condoleezza Rice. They’ve been wonderful. The Secretary of the Navy, so I think it’s guests. Laura Bush, when the convocation happened for her and the two girls. So that was interesting, especially the time constraints placed on us for that event were amazing because they wanted a three-course meal in 37 minutes. 

Kate Young: 

Oh my goodness. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

So it was very, very tight timing. But we pulled it off and everyone went away happy. But I think, so it’s the guests and the different personalities of people. And the nice thing about Westwood is that it is, as many people call it, the front door to the university. And so we have students, we host the Reamer Club, come on an annual tour, the freshman Reamers, and so they come on a tour of the house so that they know when they drive the train around what is behind those doors, if people ask. And then we have faculty. So we have a faculty event, we have deans tonight, we have faculty events most months. So it’s a nice use of the house for people who are on campus and then obviously alums coming back, and we entertain many, many people. So I think that variety is great. 

Kate Young: 

We’ve discussed, you’ve lived through several presidents here. Do you have any fun behind-the-scenes stories, anything that would surprise our listeners maybe? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

You’ll have to wait for the book. No, no. I think things just happen, and in 24 years it drifts away. But I suppose the cats coming in by mistake is interesting, that suddenly somebody comes to me and says, “Here’s a cat.” Because they live outside and keep our mouse population down. But occasionally, they managed to sneak in just because when we had a dog. So that was also a challenge at times. 

Kate Young: 

Was he or she in the way? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

She. No, she was never in the way, but she would sometimes escape from the kitchen and be in places that she wasn’t supposed to be. And also like to get out and go and find the dirtiest muddiest places to roll, as dogs do. I’m trying to think of anything else. Obviously, the gates have been an issue when power goes out. I’d get phone calls from the president saying, “I’m stuck outside the gate.” So I’d have to drive over and climb the gate in the rain and release the hydraulics on the gates and open the gates so that they could come in. One time we had a power outage and the president at the time was trying to pack for a trip, and so we had to get the Purdue fire department to bring one of their fire engines, or the fire trucks, right? I’m not in England anymore. A fire truck up here and plug it in so that they ran their generator so we could have a light in the packing area so that they could pack the suitcases. 

Kate Young: 

Wow. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Other than that, I don’t think we’ve… We’ve managed to keep it pretty sane. 

Kate Young: 

How have you seen this iconic home change over the years? We were chatting before this and there’s been all types of renovations. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yeah, so the house has morphed from a two-bedroom cottage when it was built in 1934 into the 17,000 square feet that it is now. When we came in 2000, the house footprint was pretty much as it is. And so we’ve made some tweaks, we’ve changed some things. We added a different porch last summer. So we’ve made alterations. The house I think is pretty much at its maximum footprint now. There’s really not much more room for anything, but it works well. And what was put in, especially with the big addition the Beering’s did, has made the house incredibly functional. The catering kitchen and the big dining room that we can seat 104 in if we have to, it’s tight, but we can get in. And so it is a very workable house. So I think that’s really the biggest change. And people, when they drive up, they don’t realize just how much house there is at the back really. 

Kate Young: 

It’s so stately and beautiful, but yes, you don’t really see the… When you haven’t been inside before, you haven’t seen the depth of the house. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes. 

Kate Young: 

The day that our podcast team had the pleasure of visiting Anthony at Westwood, he and his team were setting up for a Purdue Dean’s dinner that evening. I asked Anthony what a typical day of managing Westwood looks like when planning for an event like this? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

We usually have a fair amount of notice about when these events are happening. So obviously we know what the room’s going to look like. Depending on the table, we’ll see the table on odd occasion. But the table is fairly versatile in that we can seat up to 22 at one table, and the president seems to like that feel of everyone being at one table. 

Kate Young: 

More intimate. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Because once you separate people, and if the first lady is there, she can host one table and he can host another, but it still separates the guests. So we’ve done a lot more events with the big, long table. And I will already have talked to chef and we’ve planned a menu, and we do try and feature as much Indiana food as possible just because people like it. And we’re using the student farms produce at the moment as well. So we’ve already planned the menu. So then prior to that, I will give our two housekeepers, as I said, Tammy and Sheila, a list of what China we’re using. We have five different sets of China, so depending on the time of day and maybe the type of guests that are coming, we make a choice of which China pattern we’re going to use. And so they’ll get that ready for me, and then I’ll put up the tables, put out the chairs, and then start laying tables. And typically, if we have a big event, then I’ll have set the tables up the day before just to… 

And if we’ve got flowers to be done, I’ll try and get those done and put in the cooler ahead of time. Another nice thing about Westwood is it does have a lot of garden space. And so we try, in the spring, when we’re planting the gardens, we try and have things that can be cut flowers and Patty Jischke was instrumental in starting the cut flower idea so that we can harvest a lot from the gardens as long as we can. And so getting the flowers ready and then having everything on the tables. And then our staff arrive usually about an hour prior to the event. By that time, we’ve probably got name tags out, I’ve done place cards. So it’s that arrangement, that finalizing, and then getting the final bits out so the glass is ready for the arrival drinks. And then always being ready for changes. 

Kate Young: 

Yes, pivoting? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes. Yes. That is the key to this game. 

Kate Young: 

So speaking of that, a lot of our listeners and viewers probably don’t know all of the behind the scenes details that go into event planning. It’s a lot more than one might think. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes. 

Kate Young: 

What are some things that you’ve learned over the years when it comes to event planning and facing some challenges or having to make those pivots? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

You definitely get to have a Plan B, a Plan C, and hopefully never have to use it, but a Plan D just in case. So there’s always that backup, and being ready for those changes even if you don’t want them to happen. It’s just, you know that these things are going to take place. So I think that’s always the key, is trying to predict the unlikeliness of things. And that does sometimes get to be a challenge when we’re doing the one long table because it fits 22, not 23. So if a 23rd guest comes, we have a real problem. 

We have had issues where the room has been full, and so we’ve had to suddenly grab a small table from another area in the house and just throw some food and some silverware at it and go, “There we go.” But I think anticipating what might happen, so we’ve always got extra food, we’ve always got an extra place setting sitting somewhere so that it’s, as fast as we can, to get it in. People’s diets, halfway through a meal, they become vegetarian. So you, “Oh, all right, we’re going with that… All right. Yes, that’ll be fine.” So just adapting. And when I teach my classes, I always say two of the key elements to being good is adaptability and flexibility. You’ve got to read the situation, work out what’s going to make it happen, and then be ready for something not happening right. 

Kate Young: 

Beyond working at Westwood, Anthony also teaches a business etiquette course at Purdue in the White Lodging-J.W. Marriott, Jr. School of Hospitality and Tourism Management within the College of Health and Human Sciences. I asked him more about this course and what role he believes etiquette plays in modern society. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

As I got into it, when I was at Iowa State, a fraternity approached me and asked me if I would go in and do a presentation for a fraternity. And I thought it’s a one-off. And I would say that over 24, well now 34 years, of doing these, how many thousand times I’ve actually given the presentation. So it’s still popular, I still travel. I was in New Orleans in August, giving it to a fraternity conference there. I’m speaking next week and the week after to various agronomy classes. So that’s also good. But I think it’s something that people realize they should need. Many people may have been told by an aunt or a grandmother at some point, “Do this, do this.” And they go, “Yeah, whatever.” And then they suddenly realized that perhaps that was useful and that they might find it helpful. 

My classes are usually full, which is great. So we have about 60, 65 students every semester. This is an eight-week class. And I do start out by saying, “A lot of this is common sense. The problem is that sense isn’t that common anymore.” And it’s not rocket science, but it does help rocket scientists get better jobs. I think what we’re trying to do is make the students as comfortable as they could be in an environment that they’re not necessarily used to. And being with your peers all the time and eating in the dining court, eating quickly, not worrying about things. And then suddenly you’re placed in this situation where you do have silver, you do have plates, you do have glasses, and you’re being watched. 

Kate Young: 

Absolutely. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

That’s the deal. Your resume says a lot about you, but it’s only but it’s only two-dimensional. When you walk in the door and I sit you down and I watch you eat, I think, I don’t think this is going to work. That’s why we do it. And I’m pleased that professors do ask me to go to the classes and give a presentation. I mean, what they remember of it is entirely up to them. I’ve done it for the ROTC, and that one is a challenge in and of itself because they meet at six o’clock in the morning. So doing a presentation for people in uniform at six in the morning is interesting. 

Kate Young: 

Tell us some of these tips that you’re telling the students when it comes to networking, interviews over a meal. That’s something I have always struggled with. I don’t necessarily want to be eating and worrying if I have something on my face or eating too slow, eating too fast, right? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Right. And that is the challenge, and that’s why they put them into that position, is they want to see, can you deal with this? And so one of the key things I say is, “When you go to a meal, if it’s somewhere that you’re not familiar with, ask people what they recommend.” And you can gain from that information whether or not these people even have an appetizer course. So if they don’t recommend any appetizers, I probably won’t be able to order an appetizer. Choosing foods that you can eat without using your hands, choosing foods that you can eat easily while still maintaining a conversation. So ordering something because you’re trying to show off or think, oh yes, I’ll take advantage of this menu because somebody else is paying, is generally going to backfire on you. So making wise choices at the table, keeping pace with the rest of the table. 

And I do tell people, if they’re hosting and the guest of honor is being bombarded with questions, it is their job to step in and say, “Let’s have our guest eat a little bit and somebody else talk about their research project or what they’re going to be doing this coming semester.” Whatever it happens to be, so that there’s an opportunity for people to catch up. The other thing is to be aware of other people’s needs. A lot of people are focused on their own little space. We do live in a selfish world and it’s all about me, so they don’t think about other people. So passing things that are in front of them, seeing that somebody needs something, you’ve got a cup of coffee, the cream and sugar’s next to me, “Would you like some cream and sugar? Could I pass this to you?” Or just keeping an eye on what’s going around. 

I mean, they may be the guest, but if they’re going to be hired by that company and they have taken an interest and said, “Could we get you some more water? Would you like another bread roll?” All of those types of things show me that you are looking outside your own comfort zone and you are willing to take care of other people. So if I do hire you, I won’t have any worries about sending you to a restaurant with our guests because I know that you can do it. Balancing conversation and eating, taking time to actually take the food and then answer the question. Don’t try and do both. We have a lot of weaponizing of silverware at the moment, making it look pleasant for other people. And I tell students, “Put yourself in front of a camera and watch yourself eat. And if you don’t like it, this is why you’re sitting in front of a camera.” 

Kate Young: 

Humbling. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes. So just little details like that because it can come down to the fact you are a better ambassador for yourself at the table. And that may be the key to me saying, “You get the job, you don’t.” 

Kate Young: 

I love that. It’s like if you’re attending to people’s needs, you’re going to be a team player. You’re going to care for your coworkers. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Similarly, I mean the way people present themselves, if you look like you are looking after your own clothes and your shoes are shined, it’s likely to tell me that you’re going to look after someone else’s assets just as well. So even though your suit may not be the newest, if it’s taken care of and it looks good, then it says to me, you can take care of things. Again, little details like that, shaking hands, making eye contact when you talk to people, speaking clearly. Especially for introductions, people are so nervous they speak so quickly. And then you have to repeat it and say, really, slow it down, slow it down. 

Kate Young: 

Slow it down. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

And if you have to, say it again, it’s fine. Or ask somebody their name again, type of thing. So we’re trying to make them as comfortable as possible and feel like their education is the starting point, but what they make out of their lives is something that they have to do and have a wide range of topics to talk about. Because if all you can talk about is your school, it’s fine. But there’s a bigger world out there. 

And I also tell people to do some research before you go. If your interview’s in Seattle, get the Seattle paper off the internet, read it, find out what’s going on so that when you go there, you can talk to people who live in Seattle about things that are happening in Seattle. They feel that you have tried to integrate yourself already rather than just assuming that everything is… And I ask my students in class, “Can you name me the mayor of Lafayette?” “No.” Can you name me the mayor of West Lafayette?” “No.” I say, “You’ve lived here four years. You have to be able to know it, because if you go to something here and you can’t do that, people are going to think you really are so distanced from reality.” 

Kate Young: 

Have you ever had students, I’m sure you have, come back to you and say, “I was in a really tricky interview”? Or, “Hey, I was at this networking event and I thought back to your class and what you told us.” 

Anthony Cawdron: 

I’d say that the thing that I’ve had most people comment on after the fact is the ability to hold a glass, a plate, and a fork in one hand. So you’ve got your plate, your glass, and your fork, and so your right hand is still free to shake hands and you are able to deal with all of the food and drink in one hand, and you look sophisticated. 

Kate Young: 

Polished doing it. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

And you’re polished. And you can multitask, and you didn’t have to write it on your resume. But I’ve had several students come back to me and say, “I was the only one who could do it.” Or, “I felt so comfortable because I knew what I was supposed to do, whereas everyone else was juggling things.” So yeah, so that one’s probably the one that I get the most. So would you like one of these scones now? 

Kate Young: 

Yes. I’m so excited because I don’t think I’ve ever tried one with this cream. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes. 

Kate Young: 

So tell us. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

So English scones typically, and you always split them, you never cut them. 

Kate Young: 

Okay. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

And usually you have red jam, we call it jam, you call it jelly. We call it jam. So you take some jam and put it onto your plate. Come off. And then you have some cream. And in England, you’ll probably find it’s clotted cream, which is hard to find here, which is a heated cream. So it’s a little bit more weighty and fat content. Pass that over to you. 

Kate Young: 

Thank you. Okay, so you’re not taking the knife and directly putting it on I’ve noticed. Okay. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

No. Sometimes when we do reception events here, chef makes wonderful scones. We will actually split them and spread them so that people don’t have to work with that. Because again, when you’re designing food for large groups, you have to have things that are easy to eat, quick and easy to pick up. So then the key is to take a little bit of jam and put it on about a bite-size piece of the scone. 

Kate Young: 

So not the whole thing? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

No. 

Kate Young: 

Okay. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

So complicated being English. And then you put some cream on the top. 

Kate Young: 

Okay. And we did jam first, like you said. Okay. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Some people will even put butter first, then jam, then cream. 

Kate Young: 

That’s a lot. The cream is insanely delicious. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Good. 

Kate Young: 

And so is the scone. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Whipped this morning. 

Kate Young: 

Oh my goodness. Okay. Now see how I was taking both hands? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

You’ll see people do that as sometimes… That’s another thing I tell students is, when I go around the class at the beginning of the semester, I ask them what their worst habit is. 75% of them say procrastination, which I can’t do anything about. 

Kate Young: 

Sounds like a college student. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

And then the next one is fidgeting, because they’re always playing with things that probably from growing up, they were always playing with a phone or a game or something. So sometimes that has now secured both of my hands and I’m not doing anything silly with them. Whereas, if I have one and I’m free, people start to play with things or they fiddle or they play with their hair, or they chew their nails. 

Kate Young: 

Which, in a job interview, it’s just such a turn-off. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

So it’s distracting. So sometimes adding that extra hand just gives your hand something to do. But generally, you would only hold with one. And stirring too, stir quietly. 

Kate Young: 

In October, Anthony received the Special Boilermaker Award, which honors members of the Purdue faculty or staff who have contributed significantly to the improvement of the quality of life or the betterment of the educational experience for Purdue students. Anthony shares what this award means to him. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

It was a very special moment, and it was quite a surprise being told I had it because I was at a meeting in Hovde and we were leaving the meeting and Teresa Cadwallader, who is Mung’s executive assistant said, “Oh, could you just pop in here?” And I thought, what is this? And so she opened the door, and ta-da. And so that was a big surprise. And then obviously going down onto the field last, or to receive it, was a very special honor. It was a wonderful honor. And obviously my co-recipients, we had a great time. And so it was very, very special. 

I guess it’s… I don’t know whether there’s a bingo card of things that if you’re at Purdue this long, you get one of these. And if you get this long, you get one of these. So I was in Reamer, I was in Iron Key, Mortar Board, Old Master, so my bingo card’s getting full. But yes, no, it was a very nice honor, very nice. And I’ve had many, many messages, and 450 messages on Facebook after it was Eric Barker, Dean Eric Barker, took some really nice pictures and so they were on Facebook, so a lot of people responded to that. And then I had people text me from who were in the Buchanan Club saying, “Oh yep, three of us up here are also Boilermaker Award recipients in the past, and we’re here cheering for you and thanks for joining our ranks, if you like.” So it was very, very nice. 

Kate Young: 

I can tell Purdue means a lot to you. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes, it does. 

Kate Young: 

Why have you stayed here this many years? Why? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

I sometimes ask myself the same question. I don’t always give myself the same answer. It has worked out really well. As I say, I started out expecting to be in the US for a year, and that turned into 34. I do love the variety of the US, obviously we are here in the Midwest and we have our wonderful seasonal changes, which I really do enjoy. I think it’s nice to still have winter. Having lived in Switzerland and being in the snow for three or four months a year, you miss things like that if you were in a warmer state. So I really do like the seasonal changes, and particularly I enjoy gardening and things outside, so it’s nice to see and to be able to make changes and not that the landscape is going to be the same day-in, day-out as if you were in some other states to the west maybe. So it’s nice having that variety. 

The ability to travel relatively easily. I do miss public transport, I do miss European trains, but you get around here, but it is an easy place to move from and to go and see different parts of the country and travel. So I think the Midwest is, and many people who travel from here after they graduate, go and live in metropolitan areas, but then eventually return to the Midwest because they say it’s just a better place to live and to bring up families and things like that. So people are very warm. It’s a very accepting and very welcoming community. And I think that that’s why I ended up staying at Iowa State is that people probably said, “We’re interested in making you do something different and getting on with the master’s degree and then this.” 

So that also goes back to one of the things I tell students is that, “Yes, your degree may be in biomechanical engineering or whatever it happens, biomedical engineering. That doesn’t necessarily mean that you are going to stay in that field. And if something comes along that says to you, ‘That sounds interesting, let me try that.'” And I say, “At 22, you have nothing to lose. If you don’t like it, great, you can try something else.” And you can, at that point, probably still fit all your belongings into one vehicle. So if you need to travel, you can do it now because as life gets more complicated- 

Kate Young: 

You’re tied down more. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

… it’s a lot harder to make those changes. And I think when I first took my first job at Blenheim Palace, I didn’t know that that would lead to this. I mean, it was a one-off, three-week job for the Christmas holidays with the Duke and Duchess, and then, “Would you come back full-time?” “Yes. Why not?” And then everything just sort of transitions. So you can never actually predict what’s going to happen next. And so I think I’ve enjoyed the fact that, having worked for four presidents, each one comes with a different background, different sets of needs, different requirements. So that has, in a way, I haven’t really worked here for 24 years, I’ve worked here for two and a half and I’ve worked here for 10 and I’ve worked here for five and I worked here for seven, with each of the four different presidents. So that’s I think has sort of kept things fresh. To have stayed in one place, one person, one job, routine might not have been the case. 

I’m not saying that people have tried to take me away from here. Purdue may be known as the Cradle of Quarterbacks, but it’s also the Cradle of Presidents, in that we’ve had three provosts go on to be wonderful presidents of big schools. Sally Mason, Randy Woodson and Tim Sands have all made wonderful presidents in their own right. And all three have asked me to go with them. 

Kate Young: 

There’s a behind-the-scenes story. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yeah. 

Kate Young: 

What does this Boilermaker community, and being part of it, mean to you? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

I do really like living in Lafayette, West Lafayette. I live downtown, and when friends come to visit from England particularly, we’ll walk around downtown or go to a restaurant. People know you, they come up to you, they recognize you, they talk to you. I’ll sit on my porch and people will say hello or stop and chat on the porch. And so it has a very nice feel that you don’t always get in other countries because people are either too busy or they feel that they can’t talk to people because they don’t know them yet or they’re not familiar with them. So there’s a lot to the Midwestern warmth and welcoming feel. 

And as you know, and I know, when we travel to different states, it’s not always the same. You feel like an outsider in some states. So the community itself is wonderful. Made lots and lots of friends, either from guests coming here or from working relationships. And then alumni and donors and people and having traveled with Purdue as well, that’s another really good way of establishing a bond of friendship with people that you may not normally have had a chance to meet. 

Kate Young: 

Okay. With the holiday season in full swing, we couldn’t let Anthony go without asking some burning questions when it comes to etiquette. So for our listeners who may be preparing for holiday events, whether you’re hosting or attending as a guest, Anthony shares his top advice, including avoiding the rather popular Irish exit strategy. Are you guilty of doing this a time or two? I know I am. Here’s Anthony. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

A little more tea? 

Kate Young: 

Yes, actually. It’s delicious, thank you. So for people hosting events or maybe attending events, what is a small, thoughtful gift that you could give to the host of a dinner party, let’s say? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes. And the whole notion of giving gifts is changing. Gift-giving, certainly in the corporate world, is now almost frowned upon because it’s a difficult gray area. One thing to remember is that the host has asked you there because they want you there, they didn’t necessarily want you to bring anything. So there was, I think in the past, almost an obligation that people felt that, I have to take a gift. And that’s not the case. If you feel like taking something, that’s fine. The host will appreciate it, but don’t feel that you can’t go empty-handed. 

Kate Young: 

Okay. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

The other thing to think about is something, particularly if the host is greeting you and you hand them this, then they’ve got to deal with it. So giving them something that they can easily say, “Oh, that’s lovely, thank you.” And put it down and then it’s out… They don’t have to… So when people bring flowers, it’s very, very pleasant, it’s very nice. But if they’re not already arranged or in some container, then, oh, I’ve got to deal with these now, let me put them down. Or, they should probably go in water, oh, oh, oh, oh. And if you’ve got someone at your event coordinator standing right there, yes you can probably hand off a gift, but it makes it awkward for people. So particularly around the holidays, I think a small ornament or a handmade ornament or if… There are lots of little arts and crafts shops here in town that sell small gestures, those are nice. Commemorative ornaments are nice. Homemade food, if you’re somebody who’s very good at making chocolates or something like that, just a little gesture. 

If you are going to take flowers, as I say, take them already in a vase or in something that the host doesn’t have to then deal with them immediately, that they can just be placed. And also, people have probably done their own decorating. They’ve probably already got flowers on the table, they’ve probably already got most of that. So unless you know them very well and you’re just taking something that you know will fit in with the theme or the decor, it can be a little bit of a juxtaposition. A lot of people take bottles of wine. 

Kate Young: 

Yes, I’ve done that. How do you feel about that? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Which is fine. That’s fine. The expectation is that you take the bottle of wine and it’s really a gift, don’t expect to drink it. 

Kate Young: 

Right. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

If you have particular wine, so if we were planning a dinner party and you were hooking and I said, “Let me bring the wine.” I would ask you what you’re making, and then I would bring a wine that was appropriate and we would both know ahead of time, I would bring the wine in a way that it was ready to be served by you, but you already knew about it. So if I bring a bottle of wine and I expect you to drink or to serve it and it doesn’t go with the food that you planned or you’ve already planned your wines, again, that can be a little awkward. So if you bring it just as a gift, perfectly fine. But don’t, as I say, expect to drink it. And I’ve seen some people awkwardly, if it hasn’t been served, take it away with them at the end. 

Kate Young: 

What? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes. 

Kate Young: 

Okay, that’s… 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Well, they didn’t drink it, so I’ll take it back. Oh, all right. 

Kate Young: 

I think it’s awkward when they open it up and have it at this event. I was like, “Oh no, that was a gift for you.” But if they want to open it… 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes. And again, I think it requires you, as a guest, if we knew each other well enough and I’d been to your house several times, I’d say, “Oh, let me bring some of the wine that we had last time.” Or, “I know that you really like this Sauvignon Blanc from New Zealand, let me bring some.” If you choose to serve it, entirely your choice. But if you don’t use it, then it’s yours for the rest. You keep it. 

Kate Young: 

And you do not take it home. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

And sometimes a host gifts, if they’re wrapped, don’t expect that the host is going to unwrap it then. 

Kate Young: 

Oh, okay, that’s a good tip. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

So sometimes if it is a little ornament, just bringing it unadorned so that they can see it immediately so that they don’t have to then unwrap it and then thank you. They can say, “Oh, that’s pretty, that’s lovely. I’ll put it on the tree.” Something like that. 

Kate Young: 

Right, because they have enough going on. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yeah, so you don’t want to confuse things. And that’s why we have at weddings and big events, a table for gifts that you can just put them on, and a basket for cards if people bring them, there’s no absolute necessity to physically hand it to me and then you can retrieve them and then thank people later. 

Kate Young: 

Okay, small talk. Some people hate it, some people are gifted at it. What are some small talk dinner conversation starters? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Right. So again, part of it, doing your homework. You don’t have to be the NSA, but you can do a little bit of background. The other thing that people don’t do particularly well is actively listen. So while a conversation is going on, you may have said something that didn’t then get developed into a further conversation, but I picked it up. And so then when you and I are sitting somewhere, I say, “Didn’t I hear that you just say that you were going to The Bahamas for Christmas? Oh, that’ll be nice.” Or, “Did you just come back from the Maldives?” And anytime that you can ask people things that make them want to talk is a good way because it’s a conversation. It’s not me lecturing, it’s you listening and then adding in and back and forth. 

So having actively listened or found out some details or that you just got a new puppy or that I saw in the newspaper that you just received the Special Boilermaker Award or you just became small business of the year. All of those things I have stored that I can bring out and use if I need to. We’ve talked a lot about the change of seasons, and is fall your favorite season? And it’s giving people an open-ended question allows them to express, and then it should also then lead to further topics of things that we can talk about. Because as I listen, I can hear that you’re someone who loves fall, “Have you been to Maine or the East Coast?” “Oh, actually we’re planning that next year.” “Oh, well how are you going to do it, by train or are you going on a cruise?” Blah, blah, blah. 

And so it generates itself, but it needs someone to start the ball rolling. And people are afraid to just start a conversation because they don’t know. It sounds mundane, but the weather is a great way to start. “Did you have trouble getting here? I saw that it was stormy in Colorado? How was your journey?” And people have then the incentive to give more information and make you feel that this is a conversation. And I sometimes equate it to a tennis match. 

Kate Young: 

Sure. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

In that your first topic is the serve, and you send it over the net and you hope that someone on the other side of the net will hit it back, and then you hit it back and it’s back and forth, back and forth. And we’re adding to this conversation. We’ve all unfortunately been in a position where we start a conversation and people will not. And it’s, okay, try again. Let’s go this way. And we’re going to try that, and if that one didn’t work, all right, anyone else have anything interesting? So sometimes it is difficult and some people just don’t want to engage in that. 

But small talk is really important because small talk leads you to big talk. The ability, and the students on interviews, when they go, I say, “You won’t be spending all the time with the interviewer, you’ll be spending time with assistants, with other departments, other areas, and you have to be nice to all these people and you have to talk to them. When you’re transitioning from this office to the HR department, we’re walking, you have to be talking. You can’t just leave it blank. Even though this person may not be the person who is interviewing me, I’m going to ask them afterwards.” And we’ve all seen Undercover Boss. I tell them that. I say, “The person that you go in to see who’s sitting behind a desk isn’t necessarily the person that you think it is. 

Kate Young: 

Or being rude to a waiter or receptionist, right? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Especially at the CEO level, a lot of times when the dinner interview, the people are looking to see how you treat service. And if you treat them well, there’s a very good chance that you’ll treat employees lower down the totem pole than you well. 

Kate Young: 

Okay, the Irish exit. Are you familiar, the Irish goodbye maybe? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

That’s not really a goodbye, you just disappear? 

Kate Young: 

Yes, you just simply disappear. What is a polite way to… Maybe the host is busy talking to someone else. Maybe you just want to get out of there as fast as possible. What’s a polite way to leave a party? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Particularly a stand-up event or a reception style event where it is a lot of mix and mingle, drift and round, and you may have commitments to other things at different times. The key is to try and make sure that your host knew you came. So making it not necessarily a beeline for them, but making sure that when you arrive, you see your hosts quickly so that they’re aware that you did come. Even if you’re not going to stay very long, then do a circuit through the room as best you can, and then always try, even if the host is talking to someone else as you have to leave, try and make eye contact. Just something that signals that they are again aware of the fact that you have left rather than, “Oh, I don’t know where she went, I’m not sure. She was here just now.” 

If you can, just try and make, even if you have to slip away early, just try and make some contact with the host to say, “This has been wonderful, but I do have to dash. Let’s catch up next week.” Or something like that, if you can. Or, “Sorry to interrupt, but I just wanted to say, great party, thanks for having me. We’ll see you at the theater on Saturday or something like that.” It makes them feel that it was a good idea to have you at the event, even though you couldn’t stay for the full length. 

Kate Young: 

And you appreciated the invite. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Mm-hmm, you made an impression. So as I say, “Try and meet them when you first get there and try and at least acknowledge the fact that you’ve had a good time and you’re heading out now.” 

Kate Young: 

To wrap it up, the biggest dos and don’ts, what’s like a top, do this to impress people at an event and a top, do not do this at an event? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Well, you shouldn’t necessarily be just out to impress people. You should be doing things well, but not necessarily standing out- 

Kate Young: 

Like showboating? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

… by showing off. 

Kate Young: 

Okay. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

So keep it subtle, keep it light. I think we do find people who dominate the table. And I do tell people when you’re planning an event, think of the personalities that you’ve got. Because if you’ve got a strong personality and you are hosting and we’re doing a long table rather than a round table as we’re at today, but if you have a long table and you’ve put somebody with a strong personality halfway down the table, that person will take over. And you have no way of controlling that. If you have a strong personality, seat them next to you because you can physically rein them in if you have to because they’re right there. So again, that’s a good way of working out where you’re going to place people and who would be a good conversation group. Do these people have something in common? So it does that. 

Try not to dominate. If you realize that I’ve done all the talking or nobody’s had a chance to eat, again, try not to do that. Also, good manners can spoil good food. So waiting or listening to somebody talk and the food’s there, stop somebody, don’t just let the food spoil. And that’s also brings up the buffet rule. That if you go to a buffet, it’s very likely that the rest of the people at the table are not immediately behind you in line. And so when you get to the table, if there are three of you or more, you can start eating because those three people may not even arrive. Or those two seats may be empty or unoccupied and you’ve been sitting there waiting for them to fill and your food is spoiling. So I always encourage people to use the buffet rule, three or more, start. 

Chewing with your mouth open. I don’t need to see your food. Eating noisily, sometimes it’s overwhelming. All right. Yes. And these people are automatically getting a no for the next invitation list because I can’t, you’re just not going to have people watch that again. Overindulging. There may be very nice things offered to you, but you don’t have to necessarily take them all. And one thing I do tell students about events is that because when you arrive, it’s likely hospitality is going to be offered quite quickly. Your choice of whether to take it then or not. You are perfectly able to walk away and say, “I’ll be right back. Let me do some introductions.” Because yes, you might be able to hold a plate and a glass in one hand, but if you don’t have to, don’t do it. So go around, make some introductions, and then circle back and get your drink, circle back and get some food. And so again, sometimes that is a test to see whether people have the ability to say, “No, I think I’ll wait.” 

Using the buffet as your own private dining space. Take some food and move away. If there’s something on the buffet you don’t like, don’t put it back. Appetizers are not easy to eat standing up. We, in hospitality, love to watch people fail. That’s why we design food like that. Things will crumble. So look at the food and say, “Can I deal with that?” 

Kate Young: 

That’s exactly what I do at weddings. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes. 

Kate Young: 

Can I eat this? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Neatly, cleanly, easily. Yes? Go. No? I think I’ll pass. Take two bites. A whole egg roll is offered to you. Yes, it would fit in in one go. Should it? No. Again, just dipping, one dip, one dip only. Not turning the carrot stick over and dipping the other end in. Taking things to a plate, to a vessel, rather than just eating them out of the bowl. And sometimes events aren’t set up in the way that makes that easy that you’ve got to find the plates or the plates and the napkins are in the wrong place and you really want to get a plate, go down and then at the last minute pick up a napkin and a piece of silverware because you don’t need that for walking through the buffet. Just again, I think a lot of it is learned, but unfortunately we don’t see the opportunities to learn anymore. 

I mean, I will set a table with a tablecloth and people suddenly, “Ah, it’s so formal.” Because they’re just not to seeing tablecloths anymore. Sitting down before everyone else arrives, not good, because then anyone else who arrives at the table, even if they’re on time, they feel like they’re late. So in a restaurant situation, you are hosting, you’re waiting in the lobby, try and wait for all your guests in the lobby before you go to the table, even though the restaurant wants you to sit down straight away. If I arrive at 12:30, which is when I’m supposed to be there, and you’re already at the table, and I’m the last there, I say, “Oh, am I late?’ Because it’s a psychological feeling that I didn’t make the right call. And if somebody does arrive late, get up and greet them and help them to their chair. It makes them, again, feel less conscious, self-conscious, about being late. 

Kate Young: 

This has been fascinating. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Thank you. Thank you. 

Kate Young: 

Is there anything I missed? Is there anything else that you want to tell our listeners and viewers? 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Gosh, no. Listen, learn, and copying in school, not a good thing. Somebody does something outside of school that looks good, do exactly the same thing. You can learn a lot by watching people. Oh, and when you split a check evenly, don’t argue. No divisions of, “Well, you had two glasses of wine, so you… Oh, plus tax.” And then- 

Kate Young: 

That’s so uncomfortable. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Yes. You see people having this wonderful meal, great conversation, and then they’re arguing about $26 at the end. It’s like, really? That’s all I’m going to remember when I walk out, is that you were trying to short me for $2. Not worth it. 

Kate Young: 

That’s a great tip to end on. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

Thank you very much. 

Kate Young: 

Thank you. Oh, it’s been a pleasure. 

Anthony Cawdron: 

It’s been wonderful. Thank you. 

Kate Young: 

I’m sure you all learned at least one tip from Anthony throughout this interview. I know I did. We’re so thankful Anthony joined us on the podcast. He has such an interesting background and his love for this Boilermaker community truly shines. If you haven’t been to Westwood, or maybe it’s been years since you’ve been in there, you can check out this beautiful home on our podcast YouTube page, YouTube.com/@thisisPurdue. We have some incredible bonus content with Anthony, he discusses the importance of name tag etiquette, his biggest pet peeve when it comes to modern day etiquette, and so much more. And you can also watch Anthony’s full video interview in the Westwood dining room, complete with tea, scones and sandwiches while you’re there. Plus, be sure to follow This is Purdue on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeartRadio, or wherever you get your podcasts, so you never miss an episode. 

This is Purdue is hosted and written by me, Kate Young. Our podcast videography for this episode was led by Ted Schellenberger in collaboration with Jon Garcia and Zach Mogensen. Our video production assistant is Dalani Young. Our social media marketing is led by Maria Welch. Our podcast distribution strategy is led by Teresa Walker and Carly Eastman. Our podcast design is led by Caitlyn Freville. Our podcast photography is led by John Underwood. Our podcast team project manager is Rain Gu. Our podcast YouTube promotions is managed by Kirsten Bauman. Additional writing and research assistance is led by Sophie Ritz. And our This is Purdue intern is Caroline Kime. Thanks for listening to This is Purdue. For more information on this episode, visit our website at purdue.edu/podcasts. There, you can head over to your favorite podcast app to subscribe and leave us a review. And as always, Boiler up.